One-Stop 11' TOS Enterprise Reference Thread: NCC-1701, No Bloody A...

[phase pistol]

A trove of pics! Thanks so much!

Jason, congratulations! I was rooting for you, but I'm glad the restoration is in capable hands.

 

[moffeaton]

Yeah, and the heat is off

No "Miarecki 2.0" for me

 

[CessnaDriver]

It's funny disassembled with people standing next to the parts she looks smaller than I remember when on display.

 

[asalaw]

You're welcome.

That's Ariel O'Connor, co-conservator of the project, explaining that the Hallmark ornament is very close to the right scale for the 11' Enterprise. Whooda thunkit?

Here she is:

Thanks for those!
Downloaded the whole album.
Was that woman holding a Hallmark Galileo to demonstrate the hanger deck? LOL

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Not sure what part you're referring to. But if it's broken, they will fix it, or at least stabilize it.

What was the word on the accelerator? Are they going to fix it?

 

[Commander Max]

Not sure what part you're referring to. But if it's broken, they will fix it, or at least stabilize it.

Here you go, this is a pic I made. For a previous thread.
It shows the part was modified in the last restoration.

 

[asalaw]

Interesting. I didn't know that, so I didn't ask. But if that "before" image reflects what that part looked like in August of 1967, I'd say there's a good chance they'll fix it. On the other hand, their watchword is reversibility. Meaning they work so that nothing is removed, only layered over so that it's theoretically "reversible." So it's hard to say. They didn't go into how they apply that in every instance, such as a repair to an original part.

Incidentally, the bottom part is shaped wood, and the rectangular rod on top is machined plexi.

[EDIT] -- I'm adding this comment just for completeness -- they did, indeed, fix the accelerator.

 

[Commander Max]

Interesting. I didn't know that, so I didn't ask. But if that "before" image reflects what that part looked like in August of 1967, I'd say there's a good chance they'll fix it. On the other hand, their watchword is reversibility. Meaning they work so that nothing is removed, only layered over so that it's theoretically "reversible." So it's hard to say. They didn't go into how they apply that in every instance, such as a repair to an original part.

Incidentally, the bottom part is shaped wood, and the rectangular rod on top is machined plexi.

The before image was cropped from a hi-rez image of the E. Taken around the time of production. Even the Kerr drawings reflect the same thing.
I wouldn't be surprised if my image is in their archive. I was surprised to see where it showed up in a google search.

 

[robn1]

 

[CessnaDriver]

Well that confirms more pics exist from the school exhibition back in the day. I"m guessin' we won't get to see them though.
Boo!

 

[asalaw]

Well that confirms more pics exist from the school exhibition back in the day. I"m guessin' we won't get to see them though.
Boo!

They emphasized the enormous volume of period photos they have in their possession, most of which they can't share because their respective owners won't allow it.

Among many other things, they've established definitively that Ed Miarecki's restoration used the correct colors and weathering patterns, just too heavy and too dark. They have a lot of B&W reference for the original weathering patterns, and they've nailed the colors with microscopy of the paint layers.

The reason EM's paint job came out too heavy and dark is that his color references were mostly faded Lincoln Enterprise workprint trims.

Sorry for digressing, but I'm over 50 and that's only gonna get worse. Point is, if the photo exists, yeah, they have it.

 

[CessnaDriver]

I know there are rights issues intellectually, emotionally it's incredibly frustrating. I don't think I could sit on pictures like that and not share something.
So ultimately we will have this final restoration that should be as humanly close to her glory days and that should be as good as any vintage picture.

 

[Treadwell]

Yeah, I was surprised by the confirmation of the Ed weathering. There really were panel lines along the nacelles, for example?

 

[CessnaDriver]

Yeah, I was surprised by the confirmation of the Ed weathering. There really were panel lines along the nacelles, for example?

Honestly, I think she was being political and kind because it's a bit of a third rail. It's not like we have never seen any reference pictures.
Whatever though, it's long over and I know things are going to be as best as possible now, the model was long overdue either way for restoration.

 

[asalaw]

Honestly, I think she was being political and kind because it's a bit of a third rail. It's not like we have never seen any reference pictures.
Whatever though, it's long over and I know things are going to be as best as possible now, the model was long overdue either way for restoration.

With all due respect, that's just not the case. Ariel O'Connor was very explicit and very detailed in her explanation (to me) of the weathering, her description of what their photographic sources show, and how EM's paint job got too dark and too green. She was very specific about the B&W photos clearly showing that all of EM's weathering patterns were correctly painted. That's not at all indicative of politics or kindness, but rather an academic expert's appraisal of her source material and scientific analysis of the model. I'm a lawyer, I have a lot of training and experience in judging credibility and parsing testimony, and I'm confident she was being candid and thorough.

I know it's hard to wrap your head around it, and I sympathize, but EM actually got it pretty close to the mark.

 

[robn1]

There is no way those dark grid lines were originally on the secondary hull and nacelles. The saucer pencil lines are actually visible on screen in some shots, but the EM lines would have been obvious. Even EM's own pics of the disassembled ship during renovation show no evidence of them.

The weathering streaks are another matter. They are present on the unaltered saucer and were on the rest of the ship as well, just not always apparent on screen.

ETA: dummy here seems to have forgotten that the ship was repainted in '74, so obviously nothing would show in '91. But clearly the lines were not there in the original version.

 

[CessnaDriver]

With all due respect, that's just not the case. Ariel O'Connor was very explicit and very detailed in her explanation (to me) of the weathering, her description of what their photographic sources show, and how EM's paint job got too dark and too green. She was very specific about the B&W photos clearly showing that all of EM's weathering patterns were correctly painted. That's not at all indicative of politics or kindness, but rather an academic expert's appraisal of her source material and scientific analysis of the model. I'm a lawyer, I have a lot of training and experience in judging credibility and parsing testimony, and I'm confident she was being candid and thorough.

I know it's hard to wrap your head around it, and I sympathize, but EM actually got it pretty close to the mark.

I'll eat a bug if the final resto is reminiscent of the last one. Weathering patterns may be so, but I have not seen evidence myself
of say the underside of the saucer so massively shaded. Never have a seen anything like that before. It was a brutal interpretation to my eye, whatever the reasons and fine if he was justified at the time wiith whatever they were looking at. Nobody has shared it yet.. Just going by the top of the saucer as a guide which we know was left alone. Would it not reason that the bottom have been similar?

 

[CessnaDriver]

I mean look at some of those grid shadings from the last resto? They are just as dark as the landing pad triangle thingys.
IF they were there then, they should be showing up on screen.

 

[greatwazoo42]

If I recall correctly the triangle thingies had been intended as landing gear until they realized how expensive and damned near impossible it was to film the ship landing. Thus, shuttle craft...except the models weren't going to be ready in time...therefore...transporters.

 

[asalaw]

I'll eat a bug if the final resto is reminiscent of the last one. Weathering patterns may be so, but I have not seen evidence myself
of say the underside of the saucer so massively shaded. Never have a seen anything like that before. It was a brutal interpretation to my eye, whatever the reasons and fine if he was justified at the time wiith whatever they were looking at. Nobody has shared it yet.. Just going by the top of the saucer as a guide which we know was left alone. Would it not reason that the bottom have been similar?

YES!! That's EXACTLY what they're saying. The lines on the saucer bottom were there, but not nearly as heavy as EM did them. They were lightly pencilled like on the top.

EM just didn't have access to the huge volume of period photos they have now, nor the scientific tools. The Lincoln Enterprises clips he did have were faded and dye-shifted. He made a good guess based on what he had, but made it much too intense.

 

[asalaw]

There is no way those dark grid lines were originally on the secondary hull and nacelles. The saucer pencil lines are actually visible on screen in some shots, but the EM lines would have been obvious. Even EM's own pics of the disassembled ship during renovation show no evidence of them.

The weathering streaks are another matter. They are present on the unaltered saucer and were on the rest of the ship as well, just not always apparent on screen.

ETA: dummy here seems to have forgotten that the ship was repainted in '74, so obviously nothing would show in '91. But clearly the lines were not there in the original version.

You haven't seen more than 1% (max) of the existing period photos. They have them all. Just one example: the 1964 rollout photo on the street with the builders. One photo makes the rounds, and we've all seen it. NASM has the entire roll.